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Electric truck subsidies keep the lights on

The Kansas City Star -- Sam Swearngin is a big fan of alternative-fuel vehicles, but he’s recovering from sticker shock after buying an electric truck.

The fleet manager for Kansas City’s municipal government was in the market for a bucket truck similar to what electric utilities use to lift workers to fix power lines. A diesel bucket truck would have cost $132,000. One that used natural gas was priced at $182,000.

The price of the electric truck bought from Smith Electric Vehicles of Kansas City was $330,000 — $198,000 more than the diesel version. Swearngin got a federal grant to cover the difference but is reluctant to buy another one until there’s a big price drop.

“They’re crazy expensive,” he said. “We can do better using natural gas trucks.”

Electric cars and trucks cost more because their ba

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Submitted Jun 10, 2012 By: bar1035

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honda0105 Champion Author Tallahassee Posts:18,643 Points:1,611,470 Joined:Nov 2008	Message Posted: Jun 14, 2012 6:02:01 AM Ignore honda0105 Report Abuse When hybrids became popular, I looked at hybrid diesel pick up trucks. Gave up that idea very fast when the hybrid diesel added another 15 - 20k to the already inflated diesel engine price for practically the same truck. So, instead of a 30k decked out gas burner, or 40-45k diesel, the diesel-electric hybrid was running around 60-65k. Not something I'm willing to pay for a vehicle that is being driven for 10 - 15 years. Not enough ROI.
honda0105 Champion Author Tallahassee Posts:18,643 Points:1,611,470 Joined:Nov 2008	Message Posted: Jun 14, 2012 5:59:44 AM Ignore honda0105 Report Abuse seems a few folks profit from this, most don't.
E-Squirrel Champion Author Orange County Posts:3,015 Points:820,970 Joined:Feb 2005	Message Posted: Jun 12, 2012 1:49:30 PM Ignore E-Squirrel Report Abuse melvindale complains: "I know what it takes to convert vehicle to run on natural gas. I don't understand how they get $50,000 for it. I suspect, with all the news stories, and the historically low price fro natural gas, they are taking HUGE profits..." I agree. The unwritten part of this story is the about the corruption that permitted this amount of the taxpayer's money to be spend so needlessly, AND about those who profited from this.
sparky808 Champion Author Honolulu Posts:3,013 Points:600,660 Joined:Sep 2011	Message Posted: Jun 11, 2012 1:41:39 PM Ignore sparky808 Report Abuse Thank you for posting.
BackwoodsPundit Champion Author Richmond Posts:5,185 Points:1,013,475 Joined:Oct 2005	Message Posted: Jun 11, 2012 10:05:21 AM Ignore BackwoodsPundit Report Abuse Hope it doesn't run out of power during a blackout. Then it will be not so useful for clearing debris.
jorobins538 Champion Author Chicago Posts:4,732 Points:638,320 Joined:Sep 2009	Message Posted: Jun 11, 2012 9:56:40 AM Ignore jorobins538 Report Abuse It wuld be interesting to know the actual costs involved.
pgerassi Champion Author Milwaukee Posts:10,906 Points:2,133,555 Joined:Apr 2007	Message Posted: Jun 11, 2012 12:30:01 AM Ignore pgerassi Report Abuse Overpriced for what you get.
jtfftj Champion Author New Hampshire Posts:2,181 Points:1,250,030 Joined:Sep 2005	Message Posted: Jun 11, 2012 12:26:02 AM Ignore jtfftj Report Abuse Why should he get a Federal Grant (read: my tax money) to subsidize his purchase? Get the robbers out of DC that will allow this.
cmsense Champion Author Columbus Posts:1,358 Points:165,345 Joined:Jan 2012	Message Posted: Jun 11, 2012 12:22:42 AM Ignore cmsense Report Abuse Articles such as this are seasoning for ALL the conservative wing nuts on this site.
heydano67 Champion Author California Posts:1,676 Points:359,485 Joined:Feb 2012	Message Posted: Jun 11, 2012 12:19:06 AM Ignore heydano67 Report Abuse Keep working on those batteries.
melvindale Champion Author Michigan Posts:1,438 Points:351,230 Joined:Jun 2011	Message Posted: Jun 11, 2012 12:17:57 AM Ignore melvindale Report Abuse Sorry, this must be a bad example. Do they only drive 2 or 3 miles a day? Most truck owners spend so much on fuel, that significant fuel reductions have a big budget. If he thinks 50 thousand extra for natural gas is OK, why does he think 200 thousand for electric isn't? I know what it takes to convert vehicle to run on natural gas. I don't understand how they get $50,000 for it. I suspect, with all the news stories, and the historically low price fro natural gas, they are taking HUGE profits, because they can. They know truck buyers look at costs to make purchase decisions. The fuel savings is so large with natural gas, the $50,000 is easy to cover. Since they will pay, the converters charge (or at least this one is). However for the electric, the extra 200 thousand is probably correct. However, if he can pay 50 thousand for the difference between diesel and natural gas, then the electric is saving him money. So, yes, he is being unreasonable and merely complaining about a price. Mind you a price he doesn't pay - his employer does. His employer will also look at fuel costs and maintenance for an "operating cost" and the electric will have a lower operating cost than anything else. So, why doesn't everyone buy electric? Fear of the unknown.
frostyWV Champion Author West Virginia Posts:2,339 Points:519,235 Joined:May 2011	Message Posted: Jun 11, 2012 12:17:31 AM Ignore frostyWV Report Abuse cheaper to just buy diesel.
crreed1 Champion Author West Virginia Posts:1,995 Points:2,528,285 Joined:May 2005	Message Posted: Jun 11, 2012 12:16:37 AM Ignore crreed1 Report Abuse sounds crazy to me
10k Champion Author North Carolina Posts:21,269 Points:2,255,970 Joined:May 2006	Message Posted: Jun 11, 2012 12:14:16 AM Ignore 10k Report Abuse not only do they have expensive batteries, but those expensive batteries have to be charged with, guess what-electricity..so you run up your light bill, and not only do you pay a higher power bill, but you are helping electric companies burn more coal, with pollutants-the very thing nobama says he is against.. the solution ??..send EVs down the same path as ethanol-a path with an abrupt end..
cheapchickKY Champion Author Lexington Posts:4,027 Points:798,240 Joined:Jan 2011	Message Posted: Jun 11, 2012 12:13:13 AM Ignore cheapchickKY Report Abuse Cease subsidies.
ShadowACE Champion Author Boston Posts:9,028 Points:2,151,525 Joined:Jun 2006	Message Posted: Jun 11, 2012 12:09:50 AM Ignore ShadowACE Report Abuse swkcpl said "...It's the government. They can't be fired." Oh, but they CAN. In November we have an opportunity to do our best Donald Trump impersonation at the polls and tell them all "YOU'RE FIRED!!"
heartbroken2010 Champion Author Ottawa Posts:4,354 Points:899,485 Joined:Aug 2010	Message Posted: Jun 11, 2012 12:09:21 AM Ignore heartbroken2010 Report Abuse old post , but an eye opener for sure.
nomad228 Champion Author Columbus Posts:3,117 Points:575,140 Joined:Feb 2011	Message Posted: Jun 11, 2012 12:08:40 AM Ignore nomad228 Report Abuse doh!
humblepie Champion Author Toledo Posts:34,303 Points:2,373,320 Joined:Mar 2006	Message Posted: Jun 11, 2012 12:08:24 AM Ignore humblepie Report Abuse when clinton left bush an 8 trillion dollar deficit then bush left us a 10 trillion deficit,liberals howled like small children and now after 3 1/2 years of obama my grandchildren owe 16 trillion and climbing............omg......
Rageagainsttm Champion Author Tampa Posts:8,313 Points:1,904,930 Joined:Jul 2007	Message Posted: Jun 11, 2012 12:07:17 AM Ignore Rageagainsttm Report Abuse sure
jem069 Champion Author Detroit Posts:2,548 Points:689,030 Joined:Jan 2011	Message Posted: Jun 11, 2012 12:06:45 AM Ignore jem069 Report Abuse Ok
TheeRedRam Champion Author Hartford Posts:3,173 Points:674,585 Joined:Jun 2011	Message Posted: Jun 11, 2012 12:06:33 AM Ignore TheeRedRam Report Abuse Zzzzzz............
Blue_Cruzer Champion Author Lexington Posts:7,530 Points:1,671,535 Joined:Mar 2007	Message Posted: Jun 11, 2012 12:02:43 AM Ignore Blue_Cruzer Report Abuse Electric truck subsides should be eliminated.
carloco75 Champion Author Richmond Posts:3,721 Points:602,215 Joined:Oct 2010	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:58:22 PM Ignore carloco75 Report Abuse This is taking way too long to spread...Subsidies...hmmm...
forty-niner Champion Author Winnipeg Posts:28,632 Points:2,382,430 Joined:Jul 2006	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:57:58 PM Ignore forty-niner Report Abuse With a difference of $198,000 you would have to keep this truck on the road far longer then the average of five years. Not only would you need a hell of a free grant, the truck would have to be a lot cheaper to have any chance to make it pay; the electric trucks would never ever be used for long distance service. Even if you take off the weight of fuel, it would be still heavy weight with the batteries it would use. As a truck owner/ operator I buy a new rig every five years, because if I run the truck more than five you would lose too much in the trade in. If you take this subsidies off, you know these would not sell. Only companies who receive tax payers money could ever afford to buy because as everyone knows TAX PAYERS POCKETS ARE DEEP and as an independent operator I would never get my monies out of it; not only the cost of the truck, then insurance, repairs and the would be 'fuel' costs would be through the roof. Most provinces in Canada, it is electricity which is way higher then diesel or gas costs just check your hydro bill and compare it to someone who heats with electricity. As well, you would need a lot more electric stations to charge up, the length of time it would take to charge up would be an issue here as well.
Lerxst17 Champion Author Dallas Posts:1,040 Points:399,850 Joined:Feb 2012	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:57:01 PM Ignore Lerxst17 Report Abuse Not amused the federal gov't used my money to subsidize this guy's truck.
egd Champion Author Twin Cities Posts:8,105 Points:2,121,225 Joined:Mar 2005	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:54:14 PM Ignore egd Report Abuse good luck, if it fits your needs
59glide All-Star Author New Haven Posts:858 Points:1,050,675 Joined:Apr 2006	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:51:18 PM Ignore 59glide Report Abuse cng sounds better.
aquarinut Champion Author British Columbia Posts:1,628 Points:436,855 Joined:Jul 2011	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:49:55 PM Ignore aquarinut Report Abuse Once again subsidies... Natural gas shows itself as an intermediate transition to electric. For the taxpayer to have to "top off" the purchase of electric is pure lunacy!! Headline should have read "Subsidies keeping electric trucks alive!" Sorry blazerbob91, wide screen TV's were something that people wanted! This "green" cr@p is being virtually forced on people. Sorta like, no TV unless you buy a HD 62" model or bigger! [Edited by: aquarinut at 6/10/2012 11:52:23 PM EST]
eswi Champion Author Madison Posts:2,555 Points:685,330 Joined:Mar 2009	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:49:13 PM Ignore eswi Report Abuse OK
WIPACKERFAN Champion Author Chicago Posts:8,814 Points:1,845,400 Joined:Aug 2005	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:49:11 PM Ignore WIPACKERFAN Report Abuse Electrics are not the future.
sillywagon Champion Author New York Posts:14,905 Points:1,442,420 Joined:Oct 2008	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:48:30 PM Ignore sillywagon Report Abuse "They're crazy expensive" and that crazy is passed on to future taxpayers.
rickone All-Star Author Detroit Posts:550 Points:395,185 Joined:May 2004	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:47:26 PM Ignore rickone Report Abuse Interesting - Thanks for posting.
darkknight1 Champion Author Winston-Salem Posts:4,345 Points:897,785 Joined:Nov 2010	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:46:51 PM Ignore darkknight1 Report Abuse ridiculous
MahopacJack Champion Author New York Posts:8,020 Points:1,585,650 Joined:Feb 2008	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:46:21 PM Ignore MahopacJack Report Abuse Should have went with the natural gas truck. More cost effective and very good for the environment.
twinfanMN Champion Author Minnesota Posts:1,633 Points:457,255 Joined:Jun 2011	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:43:31 PM Ignore twinfanMN Report Abuse The government loves spending our money for us
96sc1 Champion Author El Paso Posts:8,517 Points:1,367,440 Joined:Mar 2008	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:40:34 PM Ignore 96sc1 Report Abuse More "feel good" government waste
radiorumor Champion Author Texas Posts:2,822 Points:755,810 Joined:Feb 2011	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:39:35 PM Ignore radiorumor Report Abuse NG is the way to go
sammy518 Champion Author Austin Posts:2,589 Points:539,790 Joined:Dec 2010	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:38:12 PM Ignore sammy518 Report Abuse Doh!
amteb All-Star Author Toledo Posts:513 Points:102,865 Joined:Apr 2012	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:37:05 PM Ignore amteb Report Abuse I want to say duh!
agr964 All-Star Author Fresno Posts:623 Points:71,345 Joined:Aug 2008	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:36:41 PM Ignore agr964 Report Abuse Its easy to spend when its other people's money.
big_mac64 Champion Author Tennessee Posts:10,593 Points:1,485,690 Joined:May 2005	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:34:56 PM Ignore big_mac64 Report Abuse why not buy the nat gas truck???
abcdMA Champion Author Worcester Posts:7,932 Points:1,576,930 Joined:Nov 2008	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:32:52 PM Ignore abcdMA Report Abuse it may be better suited to those who deliver in a mall area
Focus2 Champion Author Illinois Posts:7,896 Points:1,920,395 Joined:Mar 2006	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:31:02 PM Ignore Focus2 Report Abuse One that used natural gas was priced at $182,000. So, why didn't he buy the one that uses natural gas which was cheaper than electric and no battery replacement?
GGAlbo Champion Author Detroit Posts:2,248 Points:1,887,175 Joined:Sep 2006	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:30:35 PM Ignore GGAlbo Report Abuse Stop gaving away our money!!!
checkitnow Champion Author Atlanta Posts:2,046 Points:574,270 Joined:Aug 2010	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:27:11 PM Ignore checkitnow Report Abuse end stupid 'green' subsidies
PTW-Gas Veteran Author Allentown Posts:335 Points:813,040 Joined:Sep 2004	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:18:40 PM Ignore PTW-Gas Report Abuse Electric will never be cheaper than diesel or even natural gas. Electric vehicles are just politics.
Ahking Champion Author Orange County Posts:3,512 Points:604,425 Joined:May 2011	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:15:04 PM Ignore Ahking Report Abuse It's easier when there is something real to estimate and debate.
WebGabe Champion Author Pennsylvania Posts:2,379 Points:498,570 Joined:Jun 2007	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:14:40 PM Ignore WebGabe Report Abuse Oh good, more subsidies.
PizzaMon Champion Author Philadelphia Posts:5,134 Points:1,863,405 Joined:Jun 2006	Message Posted: Jun 10, 2012 11:14:11 PM Ignore PizzaMon Report Abuse Battery costs still remain the problem to overcome.